Hello Mr. Hardy
The secret move that Iam trying to feel on the downswing is the throwing of the club to the left. Feeling my hand throwing the club in a tight inner circle around my body. In a recent seminar I attended, a great teacher said I have to feel my right hand and wrist coming across my stomach. In teaching this to my members, is that the best way to get them to swing left. Thanks again for all the help.

I'm hoping that great teacher was either me or Mike LaBauve. Yes, you are doing it right. The simplest definition of the one-plane swing is, "While turning your body, you swing your arms around your body; or while swinging your arms around your body, you turn your body" (To swing your arms around your body see the "Elbows Up/Arms Across Drill" and the "One-Plane Release Drill"). The arms in the downswing swing around from the right side of your body to the left side. I personally feel this happen much sooner than in fact it does, which is just before impact. At this "just before impact" point where they start moving to the left, the arms are on the inner circle and the left elbow is starting to bend and move across the chest to the seam of the shirt on the left side of the chest while the right arm is starting to straighten out and fire across the chest to the left WITHOUT ANY ROTATION OVER. This no rotation over of the right hand will feel open to some; but the hands and arms do not roll over during impact to square the clubface. The fact that you are on an arc (and you just stay square to the arc) will square the face. There will be a feeling that the club gets thrown by the right hand, much like throwing a baseball around and up the plane to the left. At waist high in the follow through, the right palm should be at about a 45 degree angle (which is perpendicluar, or square, to the plane line) and at this point the wrist should be in a thrown (like throwing a baseball) position.
JH

Thank you Mr. Hardy for the reply and yes the great teacher was you. At the the most recent seminar in Phoenix. This is Nick the one who felt the merry go round backswing and the ferris wheel down and thru swing. Thank you for all the information and the knowledge to teach my members.

Mr. Hardy,
Thanks for that explanation. I think I have been doing the Elbows Up/Arms Across Drill incorrectly. Question - When you do that drill, are you suppose to release the right arm across your chest on the thru-swing. It is possible to release the right arm and bring the left elbow up to the shirt seam and it is possible not to release it and bring the left elbow up. I am assuming from the previous post that the answer is the latter. Just wanted to double check. Also, is the follow thru a mirror of the backswing in that the right arm should release at the end of the follow thru as the left arm pronates at the end of the backswing and does the grip employed affect the amount of release. Thanks for your time.

A good way to feel that drill is to actually separate the movements. In the backswing, fold the right elbow up and back to the seam of the shirt, then extend the left arm and rotate it at the very end. On the move the other way (downswing), fold the left elbow back and up onto the left side seam LEAVING THE RIGHT ELBOW BACK. This will have both elbows bent and give the golfer the feeling of very short "gator" arms. Then extend the right arm around to the left and only allow it to rotate at the very end. In my own practice, when I am working on the arm movement around the chest, I try to feel the movements, while hitting balls, just as I have described them above. "Feel versus Fact" shows that I don't really get both elbows bent at the same time, but when I "feel" that they are, even just for a tiny moment, I have a trememdous whipping/speed result with the club.
JH

Thanks, Mr. Hardy. I also get the sense that when that left elbow comes up to shirt seam on the follow thru, it opens the shoulders like you want them in the book and keeps that left shoulder going up and around. Holding the release or crossover of the right hand then keeps the clubface perfectly square to the arc. I think I am getting the feeling down, at least I hope I am.

Posted By JH on 2/28/2006 2:40:15 PM

I'm hoping that great teacher was either me or Mike LaBauve. Yes, you are doing it right. The simplest definition of the one-plane swing is, "While turning your body, you swing your arms around your body; or while swinging your arms around your body, you turn your body" (To swing your arms around your body see the "Elbows Up/Arms Across Drill" and the "One-Plane Release Drill"). The arms in the downswing swing around from the right side of your body to the left side. I personally feel this happen much sooner than in fact it does, which is just before impact. At this "just before impact" point where they start moving to the left, the arms are on the inner circle and the left elbow is starting to bend and move across the chest to the seam of the shirt on the left side of the chest while the right arm is starting to straighten out and fire across the chest to the left WITHOUT ANY ROTATION OVER. This no rotation over of the right hand will feel open to some; but the hands and arms do not roll over during impact to square the clubface. The fact that you are on an arc (and you just stay square to the arc) will square the face. There will be a feeling that the club gets thrown by the right hand, much like throwing a baseball around and up the plane to the left. At waist high in the follow through, the right palm should be at about a 45 degree angle (which is perpendicluar, or square, to the plane line) and at this point the wrist should be in a thrown (like throwing a baseball) position.
JH

Mr. Hardy one last thing. I know I am being somewhat of a pain, but the last two sentences of your post to me is the key. When you say right palm at about a 45 degree angle and the wrist in a thrown position - do you mean a 45 degree angle facing the ground (I think that is what you mean) and square to what plane line (the one to the 48 in zone that your shoulders make). Also, could you please elaborate more on "the thrown position" of the wrist. The picture of you in the Golf Digest article under Follow-Through shows a somewhat active crossover or "release" of the right hand and arm. Your hands seem waist high. It seems before, you are saying that there is not a rotation until later. When I hit it well, I feel like I am holding my release (almost like blocking with the hands, but rotating my torso through hard. Then, the crossover happens waist high. Is that the "feeling" you are trying to convey. Thanks for your time.

The right palm at waist high or just before waist high), before any rotation, should be on a 45 degree angle (half facing the SKY and half facing behind you) which would be square (at 90 degrees) to the plane. The Golf Digest pictures, unfortunately caught the right hand just after it had crossed-over (rotated) and it is facing more downward.

As fr as a thrown position of the wrist, just throw a ball and look at your wrist. It is in a thrown position, which would be the opposite of a bent back position. If the right hand rotates over too quickly, the chance to throw the club up the plane will be eliminated and instead the club will be slightly lifted up the plane rather than thrown.
JH

I think I got it. So, as the right hand is in the thrown position, the back of the left hand will be bent or concave. I guess it has to be. Then, right after that the right hand crosses over the left to the finish. Thanks so much for the help and quick responses. I can't wait for the DVD's and new book. I ordered the 2004 Summit recently and it should be in any day.

Jim,

From your earlier post-"While turning your body, you swing your arms around your body; or while swinging your arms around your body, you turn your body"

Are you saying you can start your downswing with your arms and let your body follow as long as you stay on plane? Thanks.

In any athletic motion that involves both the arms and the body (or the body and the arms) there is almost always some constant motion going on with both the arms and the body, even though at times the motion maybe small. Like pitching a baseball, the body and arms are both in motion together. You don't just use the arms and then the body kicks in or really vice/versa. In the one-plane golf swing, you can turn your body as hard as you like from the top of the backswing, but PLEASE, do not block your arms from the throwing motion around the body to the left. As the body turns, the right elbow stays up and behind you, the right forearm drops slightly, the left forearm rotates slightly, the left elbow starts to bend and go towards the seam of the shirt on the left side, the right arms starts to throw and straighten out around the body, etc. I can make it that complicated but it won't do anyone any good if they have to think about it in that detail while swinging. If you can grasp the concept of a correct body turn and the concept of the correct arm motion around the body, then just turn and throw the arms around the body to the left. Or put another way, throw your arms around your body WHILE you are turning you turn.
JH

Jim,

At the risk of sounding over-analytical, would you agree this move is very similar to slinging a medicine ball from right to left, but much closer to the body with "gator arms"?

Mr. Hardy,

That is a great description of what I try to feel. I said in an earlier post about blocking the hands while turning to keep the club on arc. I now see that when you throw your arms around your body while you are turning, it is imperative to keep the WRISTS FIRM. That is what I meant when I said it felt like my hands were blocking the club. You must have firm wrists or your clubface will be off at impact. The left wrist may have to be bowed back in order to do that and will the back of the left hand slightly face the sky at impact, especially if you employ a stronger grip? I now think I understand the release. The turning of the torso squares the club and just keep your wrists firm while swinging your arms around your body. Is this correct? Thanks in advance.

Jim,

Even though it is very detailed, some of us like that because
it is nice to do slow stop motion while on the course when you
are about to swing.

Thank you though--

Where are all of you passive arms golfers tonight? I miss you guys. Nice to have some action again. I going out tomorrow morning and throw some snow around just for practice. I am going to turn the torso and whip that shovel around my left side.

Mr. Hardy, it is very nice of you to have this format, thank you.
I was very pleased with my new(old) action of "dog waggling the tail" feel of the golfswing. I had one of the very best ball-striking rounds in a longtime. I am 5'7" and have been told that top of my backswing looks like Ben Hogan many times, so I am thinking that I have been a one-planer for a longtime. Things got worse when I started to take lessons, to set the club earlier and steeper going back...etc...,,,,
Going back to dog waggling the tail method broght immediate and better ball stiking result. Somehow, I wanted to learn more and brought me to this forum. However, I don't understand about swinging left while I am turning or turning and swinging left... It is not the You coil upper over lower going back and release the torque on forwardswing by initiating with your lower, so then your arms and hands are far more passive,allowing centrifugal force to take care of the rest during impact? How can I get a video lesson from a qualified teacher?
Thanks once again.

Up, because so important!

I'm bringing this thread forward. Jim Hardy's four posts here are excellent!

DaveH